In an explosive new interview, one of the individuals at the center of the impeachment case against President Donald Trump claimed that the president lied about his knowledge of and involvement in efforts to pressure Ukrainian officials to dig up dirt on his political rival.
In a Wednesday interview with MSNBC’s Rachel Maddow, Lev Parnas — an indicted associate of Rudy Giuliani who allegedly tried to pressure Ukrainian officials to find dirt on former Vice President Joe Biden and his son Hunter Biden — said that Trump and Giuliani were well aware of his actions.Â
“President Trump knew exactly what was going on. He was aware of all of my movements. I wouldn’t anything without the consent of Rudy Giuliani or the president.”
Watch his comments below:
Rachel Maddow: "What do you think is the main inaccuracy or the main lie that's being told that you feel like you can correct?"
— Edward Hardy (@EdwardTHardy) January 16, 2020
Lev Parnas: "That the President didn't know what was going on…I wouldn't do anything without the consent of Rudy Giuliani or the President" pic.twitter.com/gUcU7CNArG
Parnas said that Trump was trying to hurt Biden politically by pressuring Ukraine to dig up dirt on him and his son.
“Yeah, it was all about Joe Biden, Hunter Biden, and also Rudy had a personal thing with the Manafort stuff. The black ledger.”
In a separate interview with CNN’s Anderson Cooper, Parnas contradicted Trump’s claim there was no quid pro quo for dirt on the Bidens in exchange for the roughly $400 million in military aid designated for Ukraine.
Parnas said he delivered several messages pressuring Ukrainian officials to engage in a quip pro quo. One of those messages, Parnas said, was that if Ukrainian officials announce a corruption investigation into the Bidens, the aid would be delivered.Â
“Announce the Biden investigation, get rid of certain individuals that are enemies of the president,” Parnas said he told Ukrainian officials, adding, “If they didn’t make the announcement, basically, there would be no relationship. Not just, it was no specific military aid, there was no aid.”
Watch his comments below:
Lev Parnas described two occasions on which he delivered messages to Ukrainians that amounted to quid pro quos, demanding the announcement of an investigation into the Bidens in exchange for benefits from the White House.https://t.co/qLwZHVZuBB pic.twitter.com/7qAxOHiWeB
— CNN This Morning with Audie Cornish (@CNNThisMorning) January 16, 2020
Additionally, Parnas said that the request was viewed as “strictly for [Trump].”
“It was strictly for him. But again, I thought, he was our leader, he’s the chief, he’s the president. And it was all about 2020 to make sure he had another four years.”
When pressed on whether that was his personal belief, Parnas said, “That was the way everybody viewed it. I mean, that was the most important thing.”
Watch his comments below:
Lev Parnas, Rudy Giuliani's associate, said their efforts were "all about 2020."
— CNN This Morning with Audie Cornish (@CNNThisMorning) January 16, 2020
"That was the way everyone viewed it," Parnas added, disputing Trump's claim that the push for investigating the Bidens stemmed from concerns about corruption in Ukraine.https://t.co/qLwZHVZuBB pic.twitter.com/EIL27dtaAZ
The White House denied Parnas’ claim, noting that he has been indicted for campaign finance violations and accused him of trying to avoid jail time. White House press secretary Stephanie Grisham said:
“These allegations are being made by a man who is currently out on bail for federal crimes. And is desperate to reduce his exposure to prison.”
Parnas was indicted, along with another Giuliani associate, for making illegal campaign contributions to a super PAC that supports Trump.
Counselor to the President Kellyanne Conway discounted Parnas’ claims because they were not made under oath and accused him of trying to get attention.
But Parnas said that he wants to testify in the Senate trial because “I feel it’s important for our country.’
“There’s a lot of things that are being said that are not accurate, and I just want to make sure that they’re accurate,” he said, adding, “Because things happened that need to get out, and I think the world needs to know.”
Although Parnas said he wants to testify, he may not get the chance. Senate Republicans said they are open to witnesses, but added that they would decide whether to call for new documents and witnesses after the trial begins.
The trial is expected to begin next week, and senators will eventually decide whether or not to call new witnesses.
